AS PROMISED to our readers last week, we continue with an excerpt from the discussion on issues affecting today's women that came out of an Editors' Forum on 'Women in Today's Society' that was recently held at The Gleaner's North Street offices.
The discussion was led by Lifestyle Editor, Grace Cameron, and was joined by unemployed, Hyacinth Douglas; Cheryl Crooks, communications expert, Imprest Limited; Minka, fashion designer; Donna Duncan-Scott, managing director of Jamaica Money Market Brokers (JMMB); Dr. Sapphire Longmore, former Miss Jamaica World; Maureen Webber, businesswoman, Development Options; Shawna Kaye Lester, head girl of Immaculate Conception High School; Hilary Nicholson, Women's Media Watch and Phydellis Gibbon, otherwise known as 'Hottie Hottie Cherrie', businesswoman. The discussion was moderated by Managing Editor Jenni Campbell.
DUNCAN-SCOTT: I was sexually abused as a little girl that is on the record because I think we need to talk about it, you understand, and not until about 36 years of age when I was in a Landmark Forum, (I have to talk about that too), when I got to look within myself... you know, I worked on it right to that point in time but I had self-esteem issues. I saw for the first time that I had decided as a child that I was unworthy of having a wholesome relationship.
When I looked at my history, you know when something go click in your head, you understand and I looked back in my life and I saw the relationship that I did not have and those that I chose to have, it was just confirming the fact that I knew that I was unworthy of having a wholesome relationship, you understand, but you can overcome.
The point is that we all have experiences that we have to overcome and women, now, we are going to have to stand up. I don't know how we can elevate those examples so that our women can recognise that we can empower ourselves, you follow what I am saying, because actually in that case now it wasn't a money problem, it wasn't anybody outside of me, it was just for me to recognise that I have been telling myself that I was unworthy of having a wholesome relationship. You know, you find a nice, nice guy but because your glasses don't shape right you say you are not in that relationship, anybody can relate to what I am saying here? We have to get to the paradigms that we put on ourselves that limit what's possible for us.
Now, here is the other thing; as women, now I might be a little hard-pressed, you have to help me out with this because my mother as an example was able to really stand up for the values, a new vision then for her life, and transform the realties that we were facing as a family. Now, as a country, it is the same thing that we need to do and it is about empowerment, choosing, knowing who we are, this is where the focus has got to be because as a country we have lost our way in that regard and there are too many powerful women that are good examples.
NICHOLSON: We are constantly being reminded that women are achieving amazing things. Not just middle-class women, but you know women at every level of the society, but why is it so hard for them? Because they are having to function in a system where we do not sufficiently value, recognise, give them credit for what they are doing or make them feel that what they are doing is worthwhile.
I think there is a tremendous role the media has and I know that there are many people in the media who are recognising it and trying to do it already but there are so many stories that can be told to give credibility to what these women are doing whether she is a cultivator in rural Jamaica, who also does healing, and then look what kind of odd feeling we have about a healer woman 'boy she must be in obeah'. You know there are so many stigmas attached to the different things that women try to do, especially when they try to do it on their own because very often a question mark, why is she doing so and so? Why is she trying to do this? Why is she going in this direction? It is very difficult.
You talked about your mother who stepped out and you are describing her as somebody different who managed to do it; for some reason the immediate surrounding in which she was, it was possible for her to do it and I keep coming back in my mind to the domestic helper who leaves her home at 5:00 in the mornings and leaves four children on their own to get themselves to school. She then spends her energy and her creative hours looking after somebody else's children, somebody else's meal, somebody else's house and then finally gets back home at 8:00 at night, absolutely exhausted. How does she do the kind of things that some of you are describing she must do? How does she find that energy to say, 'No, or yes, I am going to do this, I need to leave him and go here?' We are saying she has choices but it is very hard for women in that situation to recognise that she has choices when her daily life of struggle to survive does not give her any energy or creativity left to do that.
Why are we not hearing about grassroots women organising themselves, because it is very hard to advocate yourself when you are worrying about where the bread is coming from to feed your child tonight or tomorrow morning? It doesn't give you much energy or space in your life to advocate for yourself. So I feel that I'm making the link between what you said and the issue of financial independence for women which is critical, the need for an education system that allows them to feel differently about themselves and prepare them for a different world because our education system is very stereotypical, backward and we know, that is for another forum but we do have problems with what girls and boys learn but it is hard for many girls to become financial independent because too soon they become pregnant and become mothers and it becomes a vicious cycle.
CAMERON: I just really want to jump in and say a couple of things that just keep coming to my mind. Thank God for strong mothers and strong grandmothers. I was raised by a grandmother who was hell bent that I was not going to be following in certain footsteps. She was my guardian angel, she protected me from everything. I was really lucky and I realise that but you know what, coming to my mind lately is a woman I know, she is about 40 now, her mother had 12 of them and she gave them away. For that mother, her father never owned her, and she was passed on to her grandfather started molesting her. She ran away from him at age 13 to a man who was twice her age who promised to protect her. At 14, she was pregnant, then she had another child with that man and then she ran away from him to somebody else. She now has five children, the oldest one is a criminal. She got sent to jail once because the judge said it is her child and she should have known and done better. She later ran away to England to work and then her 14-year-old daughter was pregnant, so she came back. I don't know her and the people who know her don't know her to be a lazy person. These days she is in hiding. Why? Her oldest son stole a gun from somebody, they can't get him so they are coming after her. What do we do with her? She is not lazy, I know her to be bright and intelligent, what do we do and that's what keeps coming to my head and as a woman, not as a journalist or an editor, I feel so powerless. Like what do we do and there are many of them around.
DUNCAN-SCOTT: I am saying, and this is really where I come from and it is life experience now. A lot of what is occurring in your life keeps coming from what you have in your head, you understand what I am saying? What I am saying where she has to start on is herself working on herself. Like myself, I had to do the work on myself to try and work out what was going on in my life, because I was creating those circumstances. You know when you hear that somebody jump out of one relationship and go into another relationship, the next one is exactly like the first relationship and this is not denying that we need to support each other, I am not saying that...
NICHOLSON: But Donna, you were able to work on yourself because you are financially independent.
DUNCAN-SCOTT: No, no.... (Everybody speaking at one time)
DR. LONGMORE: I just want to emphasise what Ms. Cameron said. The need for support that would come into place for somebody in a scenario like that, because I mean in a place that has the proper social structures and environment, she would have had help and even now she should have access to some sort of asylum or something, so I mean it is coming from where Hillary was saying, apart from all of us exerting and assuming our role and so forth, we need to push and to pull those who are lagging behind.
DUNCAN-SCOTT: But it is not a money thing, and that is what I want to make clear. That is where we go first and you will say, 'You all right man, because you have money.' It's not a money thing; if she could be supported by somebody in her community who says, 'Listen to me, love, you are going the wrong way,' you understand what I am saying? Somebody could have come to her, it doesn't take any money, it takes caring and love.
THOMPSON: To what Hillary said and to what Sapphire said, we are talking about choices and people having choices. I think we have to think a little bit about some of the sections of the society who really don't have many choices and I am going back to the disabled now, because in many cases this is true, You find young women who are disabled. Our public perception of the disabled is absolutely dreadful. These children are at the bottom of the society in many cases. I am talking about the physically disabled which is my area and they are just, you know, are put aside, hidden and not regarded as being important. Going back to us as women, they are the ones who are set upon, attacked, raped, whatever, and I think in certain circumstances we have got to develop systems to protect these people.
First of all, we have to educate them, but we also have to have systems to protect them, I think we have to as far as we can, women in general have to try to change that perception of society. We can look to women like Sara Newland-Martin, I am sure many of you know who she is a perfect example of what can happen and I think we should really work together to improve the feeling of Jamaicans as a whole who are disabled.
MINKA: I wanted to respond to the first question that you asked, how can we do it by building our self-esteem and whatever, and it also goes into what you do with that woman. First of all, I practise Nicherin Baishonim Buddhism, and it teaches that you attract what you are like, everything that you attract in your life is a reflection of you. That's very difficult to accept sometimes but once you take responsibility for that, you see how things change, trust me and I can attest to that. I believe in karma and sometimes you don't know what you did in the past to attract whatever you are going through now, so the best way to me to deal with that is to deal with your spirituality. Now, whether you chant, you meditate or you pray to Jesus, you deal with your spirituality, that to me is one of the best ways to develop yourself, be it self-esteem or to deal with any problems that you have.
I don't really hear anybody talking about that but I think that's very, very important; as women we need to have a spiritual life set apart every day where you pray or you deal with your inner self.
CROOKS: Well, following on what Minka said, I was going to deal with the spirituality, I was really going to be focusing on Christianity, knowing who you are in the Lord, who He made you to be as a woman. You know a lot of people say that a woman should be submissive and all of that, that is not so at all. A woman is a man's equal, a woman was made to enhance the man and the man enhances the woman and so we are not dependent on each other for happiness or for survival.
We need to know that and we need to know that the Proverbs 31 woman is an enterprising woman a woman who does business, balances her home, a whole woman. And, so I think if we bear all of this in mind and know why we were made, I think it will do a lot of good for us in the society. We will contribute more because we know who we are, we know where we are going. It's not a money issue, it's really not a money issue, it is really just knowing who you are and believing that you can.
DOUGLAS: To respond to her and Mrs. Scott about it not being a money issue,
maybe not all together, but sometimes. First of all, I would like to say in
terms of men, I rather like the doors still being open and being referred to
as nice lady and so on, I like having them there, but in terms of money, I think
it helps, because I will tell you, I have been without an income for about six
years and I have only been able to survive because I already own a home. I don't
pay rent and if I had to pay rent, I don't know what I would do. There are some
services in Government places that we are not aware of, you have to go around
and check out every single service, for instance, when my husband died, I got
my title, the whole thing transferred to me alone for $100. I was told to go
to my lawyer by the Titles Office and I said, 'What lawyer, I have no money
and I said tell me what to do.' I went to the Stamp Office. The gentleman there
asked if I have a typist. I told him I will type it myself and I took the paper
home. A Justice of the Peace signed it. I went back to the office with it and
because of the law that was in place, that says if you are the surviving widow
you don't pay stamp duty. I only paid $100. The education system is there, you
know, I don't think it discriminates, at least when I was growing up. What I
have in life or what I have achieved was all because of education from
primary school to Common Entrance to high school and then I schooled myself
further. I have also learnt to cook very smartly, and this is where money comes
in again. I buy like the tougher cuts of meat and pressure them, to help save
on the gas. I also found out that red peas are proteins and soup bones cost
like $10 per pound and it gives you the same amount of flavour that steak would
give to the stew peas, so I do this type of thing, really from bottom up so
that I could provide meals and survive.
